tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-11987503.post8827303051304894389..comments2023-09-28T05:38:56.877-07:00Comments on THE FILIPINO MIND: THE BIBLE AS HISTORYBert M. Dronahttp://www.blogger.com/profile/06864941770380173324noreply@blogger.comBlogger11125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-11987503.post-75727807066399033132010-06-22T11:06:58.160-07:002010-06-22T11:06:58.160-07:00TORAH, the first five books of the Old Testament--...TORAH, the first five books of the Old Testament---Genesis, Exodus, Leviticus, Deuteronomy, <br />and Numbers---which human authorship is alluded to Moses, is Israel's history book.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-11987503.post-51842622395001745102010-06-21T19:30:24.531-07:002010-06-21T19:30:24.531-07:00Hello Kit,
I understand where you are coming from...Hello Kit,<br /><br />I understand where you are coming from.<br /><br />But unlike you, I find no need for any established or unestablished religion (Western or Eastern thoughts or what have you), any related organization or cult. <br /><br />However, I confess that serious writings/thoughts about so-called spiritual/religious matters still interest me; though modesty aside I have been through most, if not all, of them. I still browse and/or read related books to find if there is something new in the air, so to speak.<br /><br />Also, when I travel I marvel at the genius and dedications of those who created the religious arts and literatures, expressed in cathedrals, stained glasses, paintings, writings, etc. which of course defined much of Western (European) Civilization, i.e. until say the Age of Reformation/Counter Reformation. <br /><br />I still wonder at the beauty and order we see around us/in the world and the unconditional love of some people(we can simply allude to them as the so-called Good Samaritans) in our utilitarian and selfishly individualistic world; at the same time it is impossible to reconcile the "natural" disasters and man-made horrors (for lack of a better word: evil) in the world. The God-concept we learned by rote is just bullshit to me be they from 1940s Baltimore Cathechism or 1960s Dutch Cathechism; in 1970 I submitted an essay top the Philippine Free press entitled 'GOD - A FARCE" and it was not published. maybe the Locsins (?) were afraid of the Church or its god.<br /><br />Anyway, I said much about my person which I try not to in most of my postings. Bottomline, I am content and happy being an agnostic (I can not be an atheist nor a believer as I indicated in my blog profile - the basic issue is one's concept of the term God).<br /><br /> I do not dwell much on this topic anymore except when I feel the itch. Religion or the Church or whatever so-called supernatural stuff, etc. become relevant if they really work for the natives, the impoverished majority. Else it is just another personal and institutional impediment to human progress - I have written a lot of posting on this topic).<br /><br />Regards,Bert M. Dronahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06864941770380173324noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-11987503.post-32389976919039998352010-06-21T19:24:56.058-07:002010-06-21T19:24:56.058-07:00Quiet waters run deep.
Was not surprised to know ...Quiet waters run deep.<br /><br />Was not surprised to know your Catholic background with the stuff you've been sharing.<br /><br />Seems we have some similarities with our experiences in life. <br /><br />I also lost my faith in the Catholicism, (as i knew it then) when I was eighteen and studying in a Catholic school.<br /><br />Our religion classes then did not really discuss much about religion but more on philosophical thoughts and was involved in the psychology club that had overnight discussions about what is normal in terms of how people act. Pinpointed this as the discussion topic though we discussed all sorts of subject matters concerning human behavior but always ended up with the question of what is considered normal to human behavior that made most of us confused kids and most threw out religion from their lives as I also did and became agnostic.<br /><br />Went back though to being a liberal Catholic about three years later after a sort of miracle that got me involved with a Baptist denominated organization.<br /><br />Was told in the organization to look for a church where our Christian faith can be nurtured so went to all sorts of churches to check out which is the most nurturing and was choosing in the end to either join the Methodist Church or the Presbyterians as found the first really open minded and found solemnity with the Presbyterians.<br /><br />Remained however with the Catholic Church though was a liberal one when an Opus Dei lay nun who was a professor in the University lent me the banned Dutch Catechism and asked me to read it first before making up my mind to join another Cristian denomination.<br /><br />For more than ten years, I was a liberal Catholic until accidentally or was it a calling that I had to attend a Catholic Life in the Spirit Seminar as I had to accompany my gf then with a one night seminar in Caloocan. She was recruited to be the lay-out artist of a Catholic Charismatic newspaper and was required to attend a CLSS.<br /><br />I experienced a miracle that night as I was surprised to feel some sort of electrical tingling from the tip of my toes to the ends of my hair and there was this woman who laid her hand on my left shoulder praying for me for things that I was surprised she knew as they were so personal.<br /><br />i stuck around with the Biyaya ng Espritu Santo Charismatic Prayer Community as I wanted to know more on what the experience waas all about.<br /><br />Miracles after miracles I saw and experienced and to cut the story short, I had the strange desire to go deeper into studying the Catholic Faith to the point I almost lost it when I read that the Book of Proverbs in the bible was almost exactluy the same as a pagan book of maxims of some animist pagan religion except for two verses in the book of maxims.<br /><br />Took a while to reconcile biblical background to the realities of which was taught as the foundation of Catholic beliefs.<br /><br />Reconciliation came when realizing that God is the Creator of all His creation and that He can use any part of it to reveal Himself to us.<br /><br />I also discovered that Catholic rites and beliefs have deep foundations and much have been tested in time that Catholic traditions have remain the same as the evidences of their validity and truth abounds though given revelations, Catholic Church doctrines have developed of which gives more light to the timeless teachings in Catholic beliefs.<br /><br />Sad though that many do not try to research but just make caricatures that often they attack.<br /><br /><br />Live Jesus in our hearts. Forever.<br /><br />KitAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-11987503.post-55918461775642551192010-06-21T18:43:26.862-07:002010-06-21T18:43:26.862-07:00Hi,
kindly treat as a private e-mail pls.
too ...Hi,<br /> <br />kindly treat as a private e-mail pls.<br /> <br />too many issues on the table, yet I can not go past your comment without telling you what is on my mind:<br /> <br />As far as I remember, we (my peers) who were raised Roman Catholics did not get much direct exposure to the Bible (as we rely more on our priests); Protestants do<br /> <br />how true, because when I was in the grades school I sleep over @ my Protestant cousins house & end up attending services in their Metbhodist church.<br /><br />they read the bible often & their ministers & deaconess have a gentleness in their manners, the priests& nuns in the RC are more matapang & judgmental<br /><br />I remain a Catholic & mostly likely will die a Catholic, however some sweet memories of childhood were spent w/ the Protestants.<br /><br />-Anonymous (as requested)Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-11987503.post-72338224557312257182010-06-21T18:01:45.440-07:002010-06-21T18:01:45.440-07:00Carlos,
Thanks for the feedback.
Although the po...Carlos,<br /><br />Thanks for the feedback.<br /><br />Although the posting was mainly about the Hebrew Scriptures (so-called Old Testament by Christians), there are similarly a number of inconsistencies, incomprehensible stories aka mysteries, etc. in the New Testament. <br /><br />Most Christians are literally afraid to think and to question their religious beliefs, many of which we learned by rote, sermons/homilies, etc.<br /><br />Apparently, we who were reared as Christians were conditioned that "to think is to sin". Throw in the fear of God and eternal damnation for questioning...or charged with heresy! <br /><br />Ad nauseam.<br /><br />BertBert M. Dronahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06864941770380173324noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-11987503.post-36884379447217185692010-06-21T17:52:13.722-07:002010-06-21T17:52:13.722-07:00I like this. It explains lots of to-date unexplain...I like this. It explains lots of to-date unexplained situations for me. I have a hard time of understanding the concept of emaculate conception. If I had been Joseph I would have been highly suspicious of Mary's explanation of her pregnancy.<br /><br />I'm happy to see others are questioning the bible not only to its content but also that it has been translated from an old language to newer ones, try translating a joke from one language to another and it usually looses something. <br />CarlosAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-11987503.post-87529682557131205552010-06-21T13:38:08.548-07:002010-06-21T13:38:08.548-07:00I thank the Lord for this Bro. Bert
We ought to ...I thank the Lord for this Bro. Bert<br /> <br />We ought to get together one of this day if you may permit.<br /> <br />Jesus loves you and so do i, bartAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-11987503.post-9523123550063499192010-06-21T13:23:37.093-07:002010-06-21T13:23:37.093-07:00Hello Ben,
Thanks for the feedback.
I think I...Hello Ben,<br /> <br />Thanks for the feedback. <br /> <br />I think I have read this Einstein piece years ago and I will check my library when I get home since I believe I have that particular source book; or a book of essays by Albert Eisntein.<br /> <br />Anyways, fast forward I consider myself an agnostic. My issue then boiled down to the very concept of "God." I am much more comfortable now with being one and the real issue for me is that God is irrelevant (which of course is not for many if not the majority in the so-called christian world) and that attention should be focused in changing the here-and-now for satisfying the hierarchy of human needs (for lack of a better/simplified categorization, call those under Maslow's hypothesis). I have touched on religion and society in past postings.<br /> <br />Of course, we are all different in the human spectrum. To discuss politics and religions one has to be enlightened in approach, again much easier said than done. Frankly, that's one reason I blog rather than engage in personal debates; I write and let it go to be taken or not by the reader.<br /> <br />Again, thanks and regards,<br /> <br />BertBert M. Dronahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06864941770380173324noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-11987503.post-75819067558583233622010-06-21T13:19:05.232-07:002010-06-21T13:19:05.232-07:00Hi Rudy,
Thanks for the response and encouragemen...Hi Rudy,<br /><br />Thanks for the response and encouragement.<br /><br />Yes, to me the Bible is full of "entertaining" stories and myths; though to many peoples, past and present, it served/serves as a moral compass. The danger as we know is in the interpretations or spins that were and are being made to justify certain decisions and actions.<br /><br />Regards,<br /><br />BertBert M. Dronahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06864941770380173324noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-11987503.post-22299267927865964992010-06-21T13:12:26.466-07:002010-06-21T13:12:26.466-07:00Hi Bert,
I usually do not participate in conversa...Hi Bert,<br />I usually do not participate in conversations about religion and politics, two topics that intiate passionate and diverse opinions but I<br />would like to share with you an article by Albert Einstein on "Religion and Science" which puts the origin and evolution of religion in a broader perspective and comes up with some conclusions. Please see attached.<br /><br />Best,<br />BenAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-11987503.post-3951054287583589332010-06-21T13:09:43.332-07:002010-06-21T13:09:43.332-07:00Bert, this piece of yours is timely and well done....Bert, this piece of yours is timely and well done.<br /><br /><br />To add a perspective (wrinkle) to bible history, here is one source you might wish to consult (from the LA Public Library): David M. Eichorn's, CAIN: SON THE THE SERPENT, Whittier Books, NYC, 1957. A perplexing read to say the least.<br /><br /><br />A Jewish doctor of divinity, author copiously researched and quoted Hebrew sages on their take of the 4th chapter of the book of Genesis (Midrash). True, most Catholics hardly had meaningful exposure to the bible, esp. the Old Testament. The Genesis boring for its kilometric genealogy of the Jewish people. Some priests do not have the confidence handle bible classes, as you probably experienced in the seminary. As you know, Jewish youth are required to recite parts of the Torah when they reach puberty... at their Bar / Bat Mitzvah. Observant Jews live by it.<br /><br /><br />The Midrash researched by Eichorn claim that Cain was the fruit of Eve's one-time intimacy with the Devil in Paradise, while Abel was Adam's. Yes, she was a two-timer! Moreover, that there were daughters espoused to Cain and Abel to multiply the human race. <br /><br /><br />Author tells the story of the first son's life with Adam and Eve, but focused on events leading to Cain killing Abel and thereafter. The extreme passion involved is so vivid, lending human dimension to an otherwise archaic section of the bible.<br /><br /><br />Found it a worth while read (still on it); you might find it so in the context of this series.<br /><br /><br />Keep on writing and sharing with your 40,000+ readers, Bert.<br /><br /><br />Rudy OrdonezAnonymousnoreply@blogger.com